EP 11 Vaccines Artefacts and Coups African News Review PODCAST 🌍

In this episode of African News Review, hosts Adesoji Iginla and Aya Fubara Eneli Esq discuss a range of pressing issues affecting both the U.S. and Africa. 

They explore the shifting political landscape in the U.S., particularly regarding voting rights and recent elections. 

The conversation then delves into the ethical implications of vaccine trials in Africa, the historical exploitation of African people in medical research, and the need for African leaders to prioritise self-sufficiency. 

The hosts also address the white saviour complex and the importance of preserving cultural heritage, concluding with a call for systemic change and empowerment within African communities.

Takeaways

*The political landscape in the U.S. is shifting with recent elections.
*Voting rights in Texas are under threat due to restrictive laws.
*The Epstein files reveal ongoing issues of human trafficking.
*U.S. foreign relations are changing, particularly with China.
*Controversial vaccine trials in Africa raise ethical concerns.
*Historical medical exploitation of Africans continues to impact trust.
*African leaders must prioritise self-sufficiency and independence.
*The white saviour complex undermines genuine support for Africa.
*Systemic change is necessary for true progress in Africa.
*Cultural heritage and preservation are vital for identity.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Welcome
00:50 Recent Elections and Political Dynamics
03:00 Voter Suppression and Access to Voting
05:36 Epstein Files and America's Dark History
08:46 US Foreign Relations and Global Influence
10:16 Controversial Vaccine Trials in Africa
18:39 Ethics in Medical Research and Historical Context
22:34 The White Saviour Complex
23:08 Redefining Africa's Narrative
25:02 The Need for Policy Change
28:50 The Role of Corporations in Africa's Future
29:57 Understanding Economic Inequality
32:52 The Impact of Globalisation on Africa
33:51 Debt and Economic Recovery
34:49 Cultural Erasure and Historical Memory
45:29 Preserving Our History
47:29 Education for Liberation

Transcript

Adesoji Iginla (00:01.548)
Yes, greetings, greetings, greetings, and welcome to another episode of African News Review. I am your host, Adesogyi Iginla. And with me today is Ayafubara Nelyesquire, author, Kwanzaa, a celebration, host, Rethinking Freedom, co-host, Women and Resistance, and now added new co-host, Grio and Books. So a string of co-hosting. Welcome, sister.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (00:31.951)
Shrink of unpaid jobs.

Thank you very much. How are you doing today?

Adesoji Iginla (00:39.793)
I'm fine, thank you. I'm fine, thank you. I'm fine, thank you. Yes, yes, welcome to our regular viewers and welcome to everyone. And unfortunately, Brother Milton Alimadi is not here, he is taking to another task and he should be back next week.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (00:42.849)
And welcome to everyone who's watching as well.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04.546)
That's it. News from where you at.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:09.261)
Well, well, well, couple of things. First and foremost, we had a couple of elections that took place. Sylvester Turner, who was a Democrat, passed away until his seat was vacant. And Greg Abbott had delayed the election, the special election to fill that seat to.

Adesoji Iginla (01:13.366)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:36.675)
keep the power in the hands of the Republicans for as long as he could. But finally, that special election took place. And Christian Menefee won that. He's a Democrat. So he defeated Democrat Amanda Edwards to fill that vacant seat. And of course, that narrows the Republican majority in the US House, making it even more difficult for

Adesoji Iginla (01:46.718)
Okay.

Adesoji Iginla (01:56.44)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (02:01.045)
Mike Johnson, who essentially has eroded the power of Congress to check the power of the executive. And so that is good news for those who are still concerned about this dying, quote unquote, democracy in the United States. But then something else significant happened also in our elections. So you know, in Texas, they did this whole racial gerrymandering.

Adesoji Iginla (02:21.888)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (02:26.915)
to once the convicted felon, the felon in chief reached out to Abbott again to demand five seats and they quickly acquiesced and met that demand. But in doing so, they also diluted seats that were solidly Republican seats.

Adesoji Iginla (02:34.957)
Redraw the fix. Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (02:50.334)
red okay

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (02:53.4)
And that has come back to bite them because there was also a special runoff for a Republican held state Senate seat in Tarrant County, which is in North Texas. And a Democrat won that seat. Taylor Remmett beat Lee Whanganas, I think is how you say her name.

Adesoji Iginla (02:56.596)
Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (03:19.34)
And now that seat is only open that the person's term was only has another 11 months. So there will be another election for it. So they get to redo this. But in the interim, it is very noteworthy that a Democrat did beat a Republican in what used to be a solidly Republican seat. And so that may pretend what is to come.

Adesoji Iginla (03:28.606)
election.

Adesoji Iginla (03:43.47)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (03:48.97)
if the people go out and vote. Yes.

Adesoji Iginla (03:52.488)
key if they use their and apparently in Texas last year I was listening to a gentleman I believe there was with the get out to vote he was saying 1.3 million Texans stayed out stayed away from voting so imagine what would happen if

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (04:12.048)
Yes, and there's so many things that they've done. Texas actually has the worst policies and laws in terms of voting, in terms of access to voting. Most of the things that were done in 2020 that

ensured more access to the ballot box. They've rolled back all of those things. They definitely have tried to impact mail-in voting, even people being able to do drive-through voting, especially for those who have any physical disabilities. And of course, we know and we strongly believe that ICE is going to be weaponized in Texas to help

Dissuade people from coming out to exercise their rights to vote and so this is going to be an interesting state to look at in terms of what happens but they might also suppress their own boats as they continue to try to Racially gerrymander what's going on in here? I'm going on here and something else that happened is Ken Paxton who should be in jail Who had been indicted or yes for for corruption

Adesoji Iginla (05:02.82)
So.

Adesoji Iginla (05:24.792)
That's your attorney general.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (05:30.252)
and went through an impeachment process and despite all of the evidence that should have led to his impeachment was led off by, again, the Republican majority, attempted, well, he did go to court to try and prevent a Latino group from being able to carry out, get out the vote.

activities and the courts just smacked that down and said that they absolutely had every right to carry on with their activities and so we'll see how things turn out but so far so good but people

register to vote, check your registration, and please talk to friends and neighbors and convince them that they are not doing themselves any favors. They are not being revolutionaries by choosing not to vote.

Adesoji Iginla (06:27.31)
True, Somebody said in the chat, there's an old adage that says when you dig one hole, you might as well take a shovel and dig two. That's true, that's true. So anything on national level in the United States. But I don't want to steal your guys' time.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (06:36.76)
Yep. Yep.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (06:42.54)
Well, my understanding is that three million documents related to the Epstein files have been dumped. I will be honest with you, I have not gone to check out what these documents say. I've seen little things here and there about names that have been mentioned. What really stands out for me is that America

Adesoji Iginla (07:06.766)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (07:10.628)
has always harbored and even celebrated sex traffickers and human traffickers. We know that because most of us who are of African descent were human trafficked. We know that because when we check our DNA, while there were some consensual relationships, most of them were not consensual relationships. And so this is baked into the DNA of this country.

While they did not do a decent enough job of redacting some sensitive information related to the victims, they are still covering up the...

Adesoji Iginla (07:48.077)
Good.

Adesoji Iginla (07:51.63)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (07:59.894)
the clientele, if you will, who were all of these men and maybe women who were engaged in these acts against these young women? And why is no one being like I have not heard of any investigation into anybody else? I know that the

Adesoji Iginla (08:10.294)
Young girls.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (08:20.602)
Congress, Oversight Committee, Judicial Oversight Committee is moving forward with their contempt charges against the Clintons for refusing to testify behind closed doors. They said they will testify, but they want to do it publicly. And so it's just interesting how this country continues to harbor the worst of the worst. And of course, Trump's name is all over those documents and some very salacious things from what I have heard, but I have not really

Adesoji Iginla (08:41.122)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (08:50.636)
spent my time going through those documents.

Adesoji Iginla (08:54.478)
OK, well, it's curious thinking that from initial find, mean, obviously they've been downloaded in PDF files. And the initial assessment is that his name appears in the document 5,236 times. Let us think.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (09:16.576)
well, his line press, what is her name? Carolyn, whatever her name is. She said that there are other people named Donald Trump, that there's a plumber named Donald Trump. So even if you see his name, it's not this Donald Trump. And even though they mentioned Mar-a-Lago, it has nothing to do with the felon in chief. Even though he said, we grab them by their, you know, because we can't.

Adesoji Iginla (09:22.574)
Karen Levitt, Karen Levitt.

Adesoji Iginla (09:44.824)
Yeah. Yeah, OK. well, so while.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (09:45.67)
That's not him.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (09:50.672)
And so-called Christians in church today are still worshiping their golden calf. Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (09:59.64)
Well, while that is going on, the world has sort of started to contend with the fact that the United States might have just stepped off the mantle of its grand empire. By that I mean, the UK prime minister was in China, hoping to build relationships with China. And from that, we've got the initial assessment that China would be allowed to build his ginormous embassy in the UK.

And by extension, Brits can now visit China visa free. So we must.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (10:36.782)
And I believe that simultaneously, United States of America is contemplating closing quite a few of their embassies across the African continent.

Adesoji Iginla (10:46.904)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (10:49.512)
And Stephen Miller has said the quiet part out loud, which is that there should be a labor class and those people should not have the rights to vote and should not have benefits like any regular human being, which happens to arguments that were made by a one-time senator, think Hammonds, what's his name, back in the 1800s.

justifying slavery, justifying the enslavement of Africans. So here we are again.

Adesoji Iginla (11:22.094)
Yeah, I mean, somebody said it this week and it was quite, it said history rhymes that George Washington and Donald Trump have a lot in common. And he said, he said he's got nothing to do with their governance. Let's just leave it at that. So that's it. We go into our news.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (11:34.896)
Absolutely.

Adesoji Iginla (11:48.236)
review for this week. And the first news actually starts in the United States. And it's that Mr. Kennedy has decided we're going to turn African babies into guinea pigs. Excuse the porn. And so the first news comes from New York Times. And it reads, Kennedy plans to test the vaccine in West Africa babies is blocked.

A planned US-funded study of hepatitis B vaccine drew widespread condemnation from researchers now the host country said it cannot proceed. The West African nation of Guinea-Bissau has suspended a controversial US-funded study of hepatitis B vaccine in infants, thereafter an outcry from public health researchers over the ethics of the work. The study, which was supposed to be carried out by Danish researchers, swiftly became the subject of fear.

public health word with researchers in Africa and the United States saying that it violated key tenets of ethical science. A Trump administration health official said the study had been paused. International agreements on medical research in humans require researchers to offer the global accepted standard of care, this case vaccination and birth, to any participant in a clinical trial. So what was your initial thought when you

got this story.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (13:24.228)
You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (13:28.344)
My brother.

Adesoji Iginla (13:29.923)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (13:32.784)
I do not blame colonizers and oppressors for doing what they feel is in their best interest. You know, I happen to raise chicken who lay eggs. I have certain kind of wiring around their coop and I take all the precautions.

Adesoji Iginla (13:55.64)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (13:58.414)
because I know that it is in the nature of certain animals to be drawn to this chicken coop and to be drawn to the eggs. If I leave them open and exposed, I cannot then be astounded at what a snake or a fox or, you know, even a raccoon was to do, right? Because I know the nature of these animals.

Adesoji Iginla (14:18.454)
rats.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (14:25.966)
I'm not calling RFK an animal, although of course all human beings are animals too. Yes.

Adesoji Iginla (14:31.912)
Have a narrate. Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (14:39.856)
With African countries, I believe there are 14 of them so far, signing these memorandums, memoranda of understanding with the United States of America to provide health services and so on and so forth in African countries. I'm just thinking, what are you thinking, particularly with this regime, but really with any American regime, if you are in a subservient position?

Adesoji Iginla (15:08.117)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (15:08.61)
Because if RFK is willing to sacrifice American children, we have outbreaks of measles across the United States of America now. We have children who are dying of diseases that they could have been vaccinated from and protected from. Why would you get into any kind of partnership with such

Adesoji Iginla (15:21.859)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (15:37.552)
entity. And so it is not it should not be surprising to any of us and certainly when I read this it's like of course of course they did this. Of course we they don't see us as human beings to begin with and we know that Guinea-Bissau is a country that is struggling financially. They have a population of just two million people.

Adesoji Iginla (15:50.658)
Yep.

Adesoji Iginla (16:00.34)
Mm-hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (16:04.912)
We know that they have been, that they, after being colonized by Portugal for centuries and fighting their brutal liberation war that went on until 1974, some of you may know Amilcar Cabral, and we know what happened to him. We know about the repeated military coups, or at least we should. That this is a country that has,

Adesoji Iginla (16:14.894)
Mm-hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (16:19.95)
Draw, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (16:34.746)
presents not as much resistance to the United States of America. They probably did not feel that there would be anyone that would care, that they would identify 14,000 children in this place. And like you said, use these children as guinea pigs. So reminiscent of the Tuskegee syphilis experiment where you know that you already have

Adesoji Iginla (16:58.446)
elements.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (17:04.012)
medical evidence that if children are treated in a certain way this prevents certain diseases you intentionally deny them that treatment to see what happens. But what we also know is that this is not the first time that has been done and unfortunately if we don't learn this will not be the last time.

Adesoji Iginla (17:30.168)
Correct.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (17:30.768)
So basically what they wanted so other times that this has been done just to put this in some context in the 1990s in East and southern Africa with HIV AIDS drugs the US funded trials Where they were where women African women were given placebos

Adesoji Iginla (17:50.253)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (17:50.582)
Even though effective treatment was already in existence, basically thousands of babies were infected and died because their parents, their mothers were denied effective treatment. And the justification was, well, they wouldn't have had access to the drug anyway. So the fact that we gave some the drug and some we didn't, know, hey, yeah, it's not a big deal at all.

Adesoji Iginla (18:02.766)
Exactly.

Adesoji Iginla (18:14.466)
just balances itself out.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (18:18.128)
which is in direct opposition to the declaration of Helsinki, they acknowledged that there needed to be one ethical standard for how we treated everyone. But apparently, the world is showing there's one for Africans and there's one for everyone else. But of course, they do this with economics. They do this with everything else. We saw this again in 1996 with Pfizer.

They had their Trovan trial in Kano. And what Pfizer did was they tested an experimental antibiotic on children during a meningitis outbreak. Parents were not properly informed. Some children died. Others were permanently disabled. The Nigerian government did sue Pfizer, but I couldn't till today tell you what that settlement was and how much of it actually reached

Adesoji Iginla (18:47.118)
And I, yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (18:58.434)
Hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (19:16.312)
the victims.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (19:17.154)
The victims. No executives of Pfizer faced any criminal responsibility because no humans were involved. And of course, we saw that throughout the colonial era, medical experiments in Belgium, Congo, in French West Africa. We saw forced vaccination campaigns. Of course, we see Bill Gates every other day. He's coming up with some other thing that they want to try on our children.

Adesoji Iginla (19:41.966)
Children, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (19:47.056)
And it just goes on and I could give so many, other stories because Africans are biologically different. Our pain tolerance is mythologized. And of course we see that here in the United States. Whether you talk about all of the experiments, gynecological experiments that were done on Black women, of course without any kind of anesthesia because, hey, we don't feel pain and what does it matter anyway if we are in pain?

Adesoji Iginla (20:13.55)
with pain.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:16.848)
And we saw that even with the vaccine testing proposals in 2020, where again, French doctors were publicly suggesting that Africa be used as a testing ground.

Adesoji Iginla (20:28.238)
testing ground.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:29.444)
for COVID vaccines. So I say all of this, and then we see it with pharmaceutical dumping, we see it with environmental dumping, we've seen it with even the baby formulas that are dumped on Africa that have a very different formulation than what, yes, than what is served to children in quote unquote, the developed countries. And so for me, with all of this, it's,

Adesoji Iginla (20:45.826)
Yeah, sugar content. Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:56.608)
African leaders you all we all have a responsibility to take care of ourselves and we cannot abdicate that responsibility to other people because We have all the proof in the world that they do not care about us I don't know if I need to do the Michael Jackson dance. All I want to say is that they don't really care about us, right? and

Adesoji Iginla (21:03.436)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (21:24.84)
Rather than take their money and their disease and everything that comes with it, let's turn inwards and heal ourselves and stop inviting death through the hands of these would-be saviors, because they are not coming to save us.

Adesoji Iginla (21:40.756)
I one thing I took from the story is, in tandem with the book we read yesterday, is that some of these ideas in terms of how to govern ourselves, we already have. But because we have lost memory, we seem to have just abdicated our agency to everyone else but ourselves. know, for one, we've got some of the most brilliant minds.

not just within Africa but also in the diaspora, people of African descent, that could help champion some of our medical needs. But for some reason, the white man's eyes is just way too cold. And in this case, the irony is it's even people outside that are championing the fact that this is wrong.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (22:32.847)
Yeah.

Yeah, it was people outside because these were two Danish researchers who have been roundly criticized by their own peers. They could not conduct this research anywhere else in the world. But RFK linked up with them and was like, I got an inroad for you. And while we're defunding all of these other

Adesoji Iginla (22:41.378)
Researchers, yeah?

Adesoji Iginla (22:51.309)
Mm-hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (23:00.276)
Universities in the United States in real scientific studies We're going to put 1.6. What billion or something towards this study? because again These these black people don't don't don't matter And of course for those who want to go further with this if you get the book medical apathied Yes

Adesoji Iginla (23:05.612)
Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (23:15.064)
the matter.

Adesoji Iginla (23:22.286)
by Harriet Washington.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (23:25.018)
who really went into great detail about the history of medical abuse and experimentation and exploitation of black Americans, but that same ideology is what we see being carried out across the African continent as well.

Adesoji Iginla (23:39.914)
And one final thought on that. It's just Dr. Sims. Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (23:42.254)
Yes, Peggy Miller brings up Dr. Sims. And it was just recently that his statue started to be torn down. But prior to that, was, again, the way we venerate these absolutely vile human beings in the United States of America. He was lifted up as this great researcher and amazing human being, even though he had caused so much harm to so many.

Adesoji Iginla (24:11.562)
And it's, so one final thought. So how do you think we can sort of decolonize this medical practice of allowing, quote unquote, clinical trials being done in Africa?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (24:27.928)
Well, first and foremost, I'm going to say, you know, unlike the United States where you have the head of your Department of Health, not even being a physician, that it is important to put people in positions who have expertise so that they even know what it is that they're reading and they understand the implications of whatever is coming across their desks.

Adesoji Iginla (24:43.779)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (24:52.236)
And sometimes across the African continent as well. We're putting cronies into positions who may not have the the background to even decipher, the information that they're signing the documents that they're signing. So that's Yes, yes They didn't understand. The other thing is transparency. So many of our african governments are signing these

Adesoji Iginla (25:01.602)
Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (25:09.016)
more like the old colonial treaties where they didn't understand what was written.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (25:20.694)
documents making these agreements without even the governmental apparatus knowing what these agreements are.

And this is across this. is with loans. This is with, you know, all kinds of treaties, all of these memoranda that they're signing. And it's really imperative that there's some transparency so that even if the 14,000 children, because trust me, they weren't going to be targeting the children of quote unquote, the educated, the elites. Most of them actually probably don't get their health care in Guinea-Bissau. Most African elites travel outside of Africa to get their medical care.

Adesoji Iginla (25:55.212)
Yep.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (25:59.896)
So again, it's going to be burdening those who are already so burdened, maybe those who are not literate in that particular language or cannot read. And so it's important that we have that transparency. And it's important that just like people came out and a lot of black Texans came out and voted during these past elections.

Across the continent, must fight the average black person, the average African must fight for a government that serves them and we must get out of office these elitists who are not looking out for the interests of the whole.

Adesoji Iginla (26:41.856)
Okay, thank you. And with that we go to the next story which comes from The Guardian and it's

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (26:49.464)
And maybe we should take down all the pictures of white Jesus. No, no, no, not being facetious. The reason I say that is there's a conflation between, well, Jesus saves and every time a white person shows up, they are, yes, it's.

Adesoji Iginla (26:53.25)
good.

Adesoji Iginla (27:05.043)
It's almost like, yeah, embodying.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (27:07.856)
Yes, they embody everything that you think about Jesus and so you don't even scrutinize anything that they say or do because my god, they left the lap of luxury to come and care about the wretched of the earth and we are just so grateful to them and they just get a pass.

Adesoji Iginla (27:23.383)
Hmm

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (27:28.546)
And so someone can be digging ditches in America or anywhere in Europe and then show up with white skin and let them not have blonde hair and blue eyes to Africa. And all of a sudden they can become a king or a queen and all kinds of doors open up to them. This savior mentality and this idea of, you know, a white savior complex is something that we need to get rid of. It's a virus in our minds.

Adesoji Iginla (27:45.795)
Mm.

Adesoji Iginla (27:58.83)
Okay, and so we go to the next story, which is about the role of aid. Well, another white savior story. So it's from The Guardian. It's titled, Action Aid to Rethink Child Sponsorship Plan.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (28:16.484)
You're not gonna give me any happy stories today, bruh.

Adesoji Iginla (28:19.79)
Well, I tried to, I tried to, but for some reason, I tried to, but the Western media is not a friendly place when it comes to African stories. So this story reads, action aid to rethink child sponsorship as part of plan to decolonize its work. Development charities new chair culture signal shift.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (28:24.944)
you

Adesoji Iginla (28:47.278)
from controversial sponsor a child scheme launched in 1972 to long-term grassroots funding. Child sponsorship schemes that allow donors to handpick children to support in poor countries can carry radicalized, racialized, and paternalistic undertones and needs to be transformed, the newly appointed co-executive of Action Aid UK said as they set out to decolonize the organization's work.

Well, one of them, Ghazi, most of our supporters are relatively well-off people and many of them are white. And if you're asking them to choose a picture of a brown or black child and choose the country they come from, effectively that's a very transactional relationship and quite a paternalistic one. We recognize the current child sponsorship model reflects a different time. OK.

Let me preface that by saying you remember when you switch on your TV and you see the child with flies dotted around their mark with extended stomachs and they will say if only you could give this child two pounds a month or two dollars a month this child can basically be able to go to school and you would have pictures from them on a monthly basis.

Sorry, I just... Your thoughts.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (30:21.037)
So a song that is coming to mind right now. There comes a time when we can't be called and the world must come together. No, really, listen.

Adesoji Iginla (30:29.966)
When they hear a different call When the world must come together as one There are people dying

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (30:42.437)
The image we have of Africa is so simplistic and I get it. I get feeling, hey, what can I do as an individual? I get it because I want sponsored a child for about three years. And then of course, at this time we...

Adesoji Iginla (30:44.974)
You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (31:05.239)
sponsor a school in Opobo in Nigeria where we're paying salaries and fixing up the school and all of that. Where we're funding a library. So I get it. We want to make a difference. And I struggle even when I'm fundraising with how I present the need because

There's this whole narrative of us being poor and poverty stricken. And yet Africa isn't poor. If Comrade Alamadi was here, he would say we're not poor, we're impoverished. And more than just giving alms, like we do here in the United States where it's like, okay, well I donated to the food pantry, which is great. It's...

Adesoji Iginla (31:43.822)
Poverished, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (32:00.631)
what if we actually paid people a living wage so that they did not need to depend on the food pantry. But we almost like this sense of having people dependent on us because it gives us this superior morality, this sense of, and look at how benevolent I am. And I, you know, I have to like check myself even in the work that I'm doing.

Adesoji Iginla (32:03.842)
Wait, yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (32:23.252)
I am, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (32:30.019)
And so in reading this, grateful that they are finally coming to terms with this because again, we know that most of that money did not even go to the communities or to the children. They went to administrative fees. They were people living really large over these donations. But more than that, it's can we stop?

Adesoji Iginla (32:46.914)
Yeah. Chief executives, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (32:57.775)
the harmful policies that impoverish these areas so that those areas can actually thrive. Right? That is really what it is. So I have a friend who, right here in my community who has a foundation that builds wells across different parts of Southern Nigeria and.

Adesoji Iginla (33:08.718)
Mm-hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (33:23.025)
Every time I go to one of her galas and I love her dearly and if she's watching this, don't hear this as a criticism. They're all of these really wealthy white people and they're buying earrings for like $500 or whatever to make a difference for these people. And I'm like, and at the same time you guys are voting MAGA.

At the same time, you guys are voting to hurt people. At the same time, you are the ones with these backing policies that...

Adesoji Iginla (33:44.898)
Hmm.

Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (33:55.767)
make it so difficult for these countries to survive economically. And so like Malcolm X would say, if you, you stab me with a knife and you put it six inches in my back and then you draw it out three inches, am I supposed to turn around and start worshiping you and thanking you? The reason I even have a knife in my back in the first place is because of you. And so thankfully, yes, they want to decolonize, which means to undo some systems and logics and the habits of domination. What we're going

Adesoji Iginla (34:24.654)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (34:25.681)
to create and instead let's see what that's going to look like but what we really need is to

advocate for real policy changes. And right now I don't see any corporations that are pushing back against the policies of Trump's regime that are causing real harm. I don't see corporations that are saying, hey, how we're doing business is hurting these countries. I don't see people pushing back against the IMF or the World Bank and all of these other investors with

these draconian interest rates. And that's really where the change needs to happen. But I'm looking at, for instance, Ethiopia and what they were able to do with their dam. When the World Bank says we wouldn't fund it, even though it took them 14 years, they turned inwards and they found a way to do it themselves. Maybe all of these programs being dismantled and all that will cause us to stop having our hand out.

and to look inwards and to figure out how we solve our own problems. Because we have what? 60 % of the world's arable land is in Africa. We can feed ourselves. We can take care of ourselves. But for all of us, as we do what we can to help Africa, please don't put yourself in that savior mentality. Africa is where it is because we have not fought for or we have supported.

Adesoji Iginla (35:41.214)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (36:01.369)
policies that have hurt Africa. And if we really want to help, even as you might fund, you know, someone's education or fund a school or whatever, and all of those things are helpful, we really need to be pushing back against international corporations, against our, U.S. government, and for those of you who listening internationally, against your government and what they are doing to impoverish Africa and in our communities.

Adesoji Iginla (36:04.629)
Mm-hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (36:29.152)
Yes, I mean in...

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (36:31.121)
Yeah, yeah, they're very complicit because it's amazing how in 2020 and 2021 you had all of these corporations that were suddenly for diversity and equity and inclusion and boom in the blink of an eye.

Adesoji Iginla (36:40.248)
T-I. Yes.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (36:47.813)
Those same corporations cannot wait to build a gilded ballroom. They cannot wait to turn back. No, now we're going to fire everybody and white men have been discriminated against and we're opposed to the 1964 Civil Rights Act. Just like that. These people have no morals whatsoever. None.

Adesoji Iginla (37:07.756)
Hmm. That's speaking on the charity question. There is what do you say to don't laugh. What do you say to countries who have specifically I'm talking about the UK now who has certain programs where they do like a teleton every year and they have this phone in programs and they go to places like Africa.

places like Kibera and a funny thing about that Kibera itself it's the creation out of colonialism. You create one of the largest open air I can't even call it a ghetto but essentially it was because

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (37:54.661)
prison.

Adesoji Iginla (38:01.004)
The Brits were fighting, the British were fighting the Kikuyu's and they needed people, soldiers to come in and help put down the rebellion. What did they do? They brought in Sudanese soldiers under the King armed rifles. They were called the King armed rifles and they brought them in.

But they won't allow them to stay in the European areas. So they stayed on the gun range. It's the gun rate that then extended and created that Kibera, which is basically a ghetto. And so you see manifestations of history like that. And from time to time, Britain organized charities that will go and then tell them that, we're going to give them toilets in Kibera. We're going to give them medicine in Kibera. But without underscoring the

problem of how Kibera itself came to be. So what do you say to that?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (38:59.825)
think it's just us lying to ourselves and trying to assuage our guilt, not really looking at how we are responsible for the very issues that we claim we're trying to solve. And again, it's this sense of, I pulled myself up by my bootstrap, so I'm working harder than anyone else. As an attorney, unfortunately, I don't do evictions, but I've been in court a number of times where an eviction hearing has happened before my hearing.

Adesoji Iginla (39:03.918)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (39:29.859)
or something of that nature and this is across the United States but certainly where I live right now if you are working a full-time job making even $15 an hour you cannot afford a two-bedroom apartment and a car payment.

And you cannot eat three meals a day. Actually, you cannot afford a two-bedroom apartment. Forget car and everything else. And we don't have a decent public transportation system. so people start, these are hardworking people. You're working 40 hours a week. Now remember, minimum wage is not $15 an hour. I've almost, no, I've actually doubled the minimum wage. And so when we don't fight for those kinds of things, when we don't

Adesoji Iginla (40:00.876)
spoke.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (40:19.891)
dismantle the systems that are creating the problems. But then we turn around and say, well, you know, I gave 10 % of my tithe or I gave this so I can get a tax deduction or it makes us feel good.

Adesoji Iginla (40:23.436)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (40:36.643)
when we're actually part of the problem because we really do not want to fight for solution and I don't know if we do it because that makes us feel like we're somehow better than other people or we I'm not really sure we might need to bring a psychologist on to explain the psychology of it all but

This is something that we see worldwide where you see this even amongst friends. I want my friends to do well, but I don't want them to do better than me or even as well as me because I still need to feel that I'm somehow better than they are. And if they start doing as good as I am or doing a little better, whatever my, my measurements are, for, for better than now, there are issues in the relationship.

Adesoji Iginla (40:58.446)
Hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (41:06.05)
than me.

Adesoji Iginla (41:12.12)
Hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (41:18.754)
Mm-hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (41:23.161)
Human beings, really need to check this ego and to decide what does success look like? What does it look like to really love one another? What kind of world do we want? Even as we set goals, it's still the beginning of the year and some of us have set financial goals. I want to be a millionaire, want to be a multi-billionaire, whatever the case might be. How does that improve the world?

And maybe I'm thinking, well, if I have more money, I can do more good. Yeah, but what if money was more equitably disbursed? Then maybe someone else isn't so impoverished that they are now dependent on me to even feed them. Maybe we all get to live in a three bedroom house as opposed to some are homeless. And some of us have a first home, a winter home, a summer home.

Adesoji Iginla (41:59.118)
is to put, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (42:21.346)
And then an Airbnb that we make money from. Yeah. Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (42:24.172)
Hey, bigger Yatch. I just want to, when you were talking about systems earlier, you mentioned some of the systems in the West also contribute to the problems in Africa. I'll give you one classic example. Well, let's just say, OK, let's just say some. OK, but these are two clear songs. Look at the agricultural industry in the United States, heavily subsidized in the United States.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (42:38.651)
Some or all? Okay, some, some, some.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (42:52.187)
heavily. Yes. Yes.

Adesoji Iginla (42:53.482)
heavily subsidized. Heavily subsidized in Europe with a common agricultural policy. But let an African country try to subsidize their agricultural industry. They fear the blowback of tariffs and sanctions. So you immediately then start importing food. Now, we talked about land being arable.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (43:11.941)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Adesoji Iginla (43:22.024)
most of that land doesn't produce what people eat. They produce primary products for the West. is there a problem? Exactly.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (43:28.495)
Well, have to, we have to listen. We have to produce flowers because Valentine's Day is around the corner and people in the West have to give roses and all of that to show their love. Yeah. And we need the chocolate because nothing says I love you like chocolate, flowers and diamonds from African mines.

Adesoji Iginla (43:38.862)
They have to profess their love, Yeah, have to eat fresh flowers.

Adesoji Iginla (43:48.814)
flowers and chocolates. And there you go. And then one final one with the health issue. When the USAID was demolished at the beginning of, gutted at the end of last year, what the, as opposed to them, it doesn't really matter, was that, to the Trump administration that is, was that,

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (44:03.906)
Got it. Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (44:16.856)
The USAID impacted a group of people in southern Africa, which regards to the AIDS epidemic. There was an issue that happened in the early 90s, where grandmothers were taking care of babies and, what's his name? Tambo Mbeki's government decided they were going to go to India to go and buy cheap intraviral dogs, which were going to be used to curtail.

the problem of the AIDS. And with that program, they were also going to get the Indian pharmaceutical authorities to create an industry in South Africa. Guess what happened? The pharma industry in the United States threatened to sue the, threatened to sanction the South African government. South African governments then went to the United States to appeal to them. The climb down was, OK, don't worry, world.

argument your payments to the pharmaceutical industry by 60%. That 60 % was got it. And now the industry that would have been created as a result of that to produce the drugs in Africa were also stymied. There we go. And so you begin to see the multiplier effect going forward, which is why when someone said in the chat that capitalism needs a subclass to survive,

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (45:31.269)
There was.

Adesoji Iginla (45:42.402)
is clearly the case. So the aid industry needs to not just decolonize, it just needs to go away. It needs to go away. And we need to take charge of our own agency. And as Tomo Sakara would say, those who

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (45:58.565)
Listen, I have a great idea for them. How about they all start to rally for the IMF, World Bank, and all of these entities to cancel 100 % of Africa's debt? No, no, no, listen. Trump got to file bankruptcy, what, four, five, six times? You basically get to start over.

Adesoji Iginla (46:21.496)
Mm-hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (46:26.21)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (46:26.617)
It gives you a chance to, okay, I made some mistakes, paid, okay, let's start over. How does Africa ever dig out of this hole?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (46:41.745)
Think of your own, your personal finances. If you make a hundred dollars, a hundred pounds, wherever it is you're living, a hundred, whatever your currency is, and you're spending 45 % of that, so $45 in my case, on servicing your debt. Servicing means you're paying the interest. You're not paying down the principal.

$45 of my hundred dollars I made is just servicing my debt. I have not eaten. I've not put a roof over my head. I've not put on clothes. I have not taken care of my children. I have no healthcare, nothing. How could I ever survive?

How do I ever dig out of that?

Adesoji Iginla (47:40.832)
There comes a time when we hear the setting go. When the world.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (47:47.601)
So how about, no, seriously, just like they went and rebuilt, the Marshall Plan rebuilt Europe.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (47:57.662)
What, where has there been a Marshall Plan for Africa after colonization?

Adesoji Iginla (48:05.262)
Wow, you mentioned the idea of a Marshall Plan. For the Marshall Plan of Europe, guess what the collateral was to the United States? It was the colonies and the Caribbean. that's... So if you... mean, the United States was not going to give Europe a blank check.

The only person that didn't have something to stand up as collateral was Japan. I said the only people. It was Japan and Germany. But the rest stood up. Belgium stood up Congo. The United Kingdom stood up its African colonies. The French did likewise in Europe. that's where the... And you can read about all of this in Vijay Prashad's book.

what's it called again? Washington Bullets. It's called Washington Bullets. I believe it's on the chapter on the Bretton Woods Agreement. You will see it all there. The African colonies were actually stood up as collateral, which is why you have US companies being able to move in all African countries. You can't see French companies going to British sphere of influence. Neither can you see the Portuguese going into the French.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (49:17.358)
at the level.

Adesoji Iginla (49:32.918)
You can see the Americans is the only constant. And that was one of the key deals that they made at the Bretton Woods, part of the Bretton Woods Agreement. And one of the reasons why you have IMF, the World Bank, the UN, all headquartered in the United States. So sorry to have to break that to you. But sometimes, you know, all of these things are out in the open, but sometimes we just sort of look like.

you have all of them here? Well as someone said, if we pay you we determine where everything else is.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (50:12.055)
And and and Thomas and Kara tried to say this years ago like Ciara is saying in the chat if all of Africa banded together and said We're not painted and we are going to sit put our heads together and figure out how we solve our own issues how we make sure that every one across the continent eats and it's taking care of we can do it, but at this point We're making these

Adesoji Iginla (50:23.458)
No, we ain't paying it.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (50:41.901)
agreements left right and center with people who we know do not mean us well.

Adesoji Iginla (50:44.342)
I mean, he,

The thing about Sankara was he was so clear and certain with what he said. I mean, it was the meeting was July. Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (50:54.915)
And he said, and he said, yes, if I alone say I'm not paying the debt, I'm going to be dead. Yeah. Then he was.

Adesoji Iginla (51:00.078)
And he was by October 15 of the same year. So he goes to show that sometimes our ancestors actually know what it is they're talking about. So for the speaking of history, we go to the next story, which is I wish a comrade was here. He would love this. It's from his favorite newspaper.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (51:24.357)
Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (51:26.742)
And it's from his favorite newspaper, The Financial Times, otherwise known as The Money Paper, which says, Nigerian military officers face trial over alleged coup plot. Detainees accused of trying to overthrow Bola Ahmed Teno-Boo's government last October. a snippet from it reads, several Nigerian military officers are to face trial for allegedly attempting to overthrow

government of Bola Metinubu in a coup last year. Niger's military said this week that following an internal investigation, a number of 16 detained officers who were arrested last October have been tied to allegations of plotting to overthrow the government. It is unclear how many of the detained officers who have not been formally identified stand accused of being involved in the alleged plot which could have ended a quarter of a century of civilian rule. There is one caveat here. Okay.

which is rumors that the coup had been followed were initially strongly denied in Nigeria's capital Abuja, with the military claiming that the 16 soldiers had grievances that were tied to perceived career stagnation. On that note, what are your thoughts?

Adesoji Iginla (52:47.084)
based on the history of the place.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (52:50.715)
think you should share your thoughts based on the history of the place.

Adesoji Iginla (52:54.304)
Okay, so when Nigeria got its independence from the British in October 1st, 1960, after about four stabs at it, initially, the first call for independence was 1952. The North said no. Again, 1954, the North also said no. Then eventually, you know, they agreed and decided, you know what, let's do talk about.

let's do it October 1st, 1960. So the independence happened. Well, prior to that, the country had already been divided into regions. There were three regions initially. There was the Northern region, the Eastern region, and the Western region. Based on the fact that the British had this idea that this regionalization will allow each region to grow at its own pace with

Minimal power in the center. Keyword. This is the keyword here. Minimal power in the center. When the coup happened January 15, 1966, the first thing that happened was Aguirre Roussi canceled the regional arrangement and then centered the power in the center. In so doing, the coup that happened, although Aguirre Roussi himself was not in charge,

The five majors that planned the were from the eastern side of the country, but they were mostly based in the north. So people looking at that thought it was an eastern coup and the rest, as they say, were the history. There was a countercoup July 28, 1966, where Agur Rosi himself was captured.

And the governor who he went to visit said, you cannot take him without taking me. That governor was Adekunle Fadjuie. He himself was eventually assassinated along with Agunin Roisi. And subsequently, was Gohon came to power. Gohon himself will be overthrown July 28, 1975.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (55:16.232)
I went to school with Goan Sun.

Adesoji Iginla (55:18.262)
Yeah, so he would be overthrown July 28, 1975. The gentleman who came to power was one of the ones who planned the counter coup that brought Gowon to power. And he was Brigadier Muhammad, Muritala Muhammad, who the airport was named after. And Niger's main airport is named after. He himself will be assassinated.

outside my primary school on February 13, 1976. His deputy, Obasanjo, would run the country until October 1, 1979, when they handed over power. The military will return December 31, 1983. That government that returned was led by Muhammadu Buhari. At the time, Muhammadu Buhari himself

will be overthrown, will be overthrown at, what's it called, will be overthrown August 29, 1985. He would, I mean, all of this is just, wow. So anybody that sees that would have seen that there is that history of military rule within Nigeria. And we get to say that the coup of 1966 would lead

to the breaking up of, initially, of Nigeria into the declaration of Biafra, May 30, 1967. But that war went on for three years. And then it was eventually stopped January 1, 1970. And all of that is still the undercurrent of all of the

ethnic nature of Nigeria's history. And so when you have military guys now trying to plot or attempting or being asked to plot, you will find that most of the coups in Nigeria have not been altruistic, except one. The only one that was altruistic, which everybody looks back on favorably, was that of Muritala Muhammad.

Adesoji Iginla (57:45.228)
beyond that everybody has just been a crook. All the military guys are

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (57:50.893)
No, I liked it. Yeah, what are you talking about?

Adesoji Iginla (57:53.422)
No, Idiagma was, I mean, OK, yeah, yeah, OK, yeah. So sorry. Yeah, so Idiagma, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry. Idiagma, OK, so, but that was, that was, that was short-lived. So Idiagma's government was short-lived. So why am I saying all of that? The politicians have largely been the most, how can I say it?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (57:57.829)
Yeah, no, Idiabon actually did some good things for the country, yes.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (58:08.431)
was short lived.

Adesoji Iginla (58:22.018)
the less patriotic when it comes to the country. The military has been, but in so doing, the military have also been corrupt. So you get a sense that...

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (58:33.361)
I don't even know that you can truly make a distinction between our military coups then a messenger was He was in the military and then he came back as a civilian in ran the country, so yeah anyway carry on

Adesoji Iginla (58:37.902)
No you can't, that's what I'm saying, that's the point I'm making.

Yes.

Like, yeah, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, yes. Yeah, so all of that to say, and Abbasov is also one of the most corrupt of them. was, no, he's one of the, listen, he's one of the most corrupt amongst them. And you can, I mean, you could look this up. Nigeria was supposed to have a back to the, what's it called?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (58:57.617)
Hey, be careful.

Adesoji Iginla (59:13.652)
Back to the the farm program in 1976 and the operation was tagged Operation Feed the Nation and the land that was demarcated largely in his area of the country in Ogun State, he would eventually take it over and guess what? OFN, which is Operation Feed the Nation, then became

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (59:22.563)
Operation Beat the Nation.

Adesoji Iginla (59:41.034)
or Basonjo Farms, Nigeria. So if that is not corrupt, I don't know what else is. So.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (59:48.899)
I mean, if you're not tagging Trump and his coins and this new arch in the ballroom and playing in all of that is corrupt, we're just governing. What are you talking about? Anyway, carry on.

Adesoji Iginla (59:56.504)
Mm.

Adesoji Iginla (01:00:03.288)
So to bring it to a close, now you've got politicians who are afraid that the military might come back. And why wouldn't that not be the case? You've seen what has happened in the Northeast with Boko Haram. You've seen the incessant polluting of the Southeast with regards to the oil companies. You've seen the kidnappings all over the place. So the large sense of insecurity has led people to feel frustrated.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:00:06.737)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:00:10.352)
Mm-hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (01:00:32.558)
And so they might just be looking forward to the military stepping back into the foyer. But I don't think also there is a huge appetite for it. For one, that is a long part of what used to be Nigeria's history. And I don't think we're caught out for your trawries and your Saimo Gwaitas. Nigeria is not caught

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:01:01.531)
You know what, on this one, I would say that having lived outside of the country for so long that I'm not sure that I'm in a place to make that assessment because I do know that people are desperate in Nigeria and that while there are, know, we don't have a middle class anymore in Nigeria, that there are quite a few people who quite frankly will not care who.

Adesoji Iginla (01:01:06.85)
Mm-hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (01:01:15.224)
Yeah, they are.

Adesoji Iginla (01:01:23.201)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:01:28.393)
is in power so long as there is an ability for people to feed themselves and some hope for the future. Because right now our young people are languishing. The corruption with Tenebuls, with the Wike and all of them, and I know some of you were getting into the weeds here. It's so blatant.

Adesoji Iginla (01:01:53.754)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:01:54.861)
With everything that has happened in the history of that country, have, I, my, to my knowledge, I've not seen a more corrupt Supreme Court than what we have now in Nigeria and what they did with Tinibu's ascendancy to the presidency. I need to take care of myself because I do plan to go back to Nigeria and...

Adesoji Iginla (01:02:12.886)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:02:17.721)
You know, I could get arrested for what I'm saying. My father has been arrested for saying less. So I do not need to kind of watch myself a little bit here. But what I'm saying is that when people are desperate, I'm not sure that there is not an appetite. Now, it's hard also for me to make an assessment on this because it has been so hush-hush. We don't know. At least I have not been able to pass a pain.

Adesoji Iginla (01:02:39.312)
What the details. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:02:41.071)
the names of these 16 officials. I don't know their ranks and I don't know what their ethnicity is because you know that always plays a role in Nigeria. So is this in any way tied to Biafra to iPop? Is this northerners who are wanting to maybe impose Sharia law? Like where is the opposition coming from or is it a

Adesoji Iginla (01:02:49.709)
was blazed exactly. Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:03:04.869)
Conglomeration of different ethnicities that are coming together. So at this point, I don't have enough information to really speak Intelligently at this point on this coup, but what I will say is yes, Nigeria is ripe For change because what we currently have is not working

Adesoji Iginla (01:03:28.904)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:03:29.433)
Yes, we are not and I think that teeny boo not knows that and that's why they were so forceful in going into Benin Republic To make sure that they crossed that coup there because that was a little too close to home because if you have Mali Niger Burkina Faso and bin a went that way then hey It will just be a matter of time before Nigeria as well. so

Adesoji Iginla (01:03:44.524)
home yet yeah Chad

Adesoji Iginla (01:03:53.71)
It was only a matter of time, yeah.

I mean, once somebody talks, then we move on.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:04:01.627)
So let's, someone is asking, is there any comparison between Mauritela's regime and that of Sankara? A little bit.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:06.978)
Yeah, mean, the comparison would be they were selfless. Both of them were selfless. if anything, Muritara was.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:04:17.617)
And if you're ever in Nigeria, you have to go to the museum to see, I actually took my children there to see, they still have the vehicle that he was in. Of course not a vehicle made in Nigeria, it's a Mercedes Benz, riddled with bullets. The vehicle.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:23.628)
to see the car. Yep.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:31.438)
And that was the last time he drove himself alone. He used to drive himself. Yeah. That was the last day. He was supposed to go under, you know, normally the head of state were supposed to be covered by security, but he used to drive himself around. And that was the day he was supposed to stop doing that. That was the day he got assassinated. Yeah.

The sovereign thought I wanted to leave you with was, you remember when Sonia Batcha passed on June 1998? He passed on June 1998. Colonel Major General, General Abdus Salaam took over power. He handled over power in May 25, May 25, yeah, May 25 of 1999. So essentially maybe about a year. In that one year,

Nigeria's foreign reserves went from 27 billion to 15 billion US dollars a year. that alone, military, exactly, yes, wow. The military have, nah, nobody wants that. Not at this point in time.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:05:55.761)
Yeah, but what are our reserves right now on the teeny boo? We where our debt has almost tripled And we have nothing to show for it But then even just even that even what you just said now that our reserves have to be in us dollars Oh my god, let's move on to the next topic

Adesoji Iginla (01:05:59.444)
Well, I mean, but that's a that's a combination. I'm talking about

Adesoji Iginla (01:06:13.106)
But that's because we sell our oil, and our oil is held in ESD. Oops. OK, for our final story, and yes, for people who are first time here, if you're finding value, please do like, share, subscribe to the podcast. yes, we continue.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:06:18.327)
Yeah, hopefully Bricks rises up and can help us change some things quickly here.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:06:40.909)
Like and share. Yes, read the good words.

Adesoji Iginla (01:06:42.582)
Like and share, yes. Yeah. So the final story is out of Sudan. For one, we're not talking about the people, but we're actually talking about the memory of the place. So according to Radio France International, there is a race on to save Sudan's plundered heritage as museums for victims to war. In almost three years of civil war in Sudan, the country's museum has been ravaged.

with thousands of his archaeological treasures looted and feared trafficked. Researchers in Sudan and beyond are racing to catalog and recover the losses estimated at 110 million US dollars. So what happened? The Sudan National Museum in Khartoum bears battle scars. Beneath holes left in its facade by rocket fire, a large bay window lies shattered. The gardens are littered with explosive

home to a vast collection tracing thousands of years of human history in the Nile Valley. The building was ransacked when paramilitary fighting the armed forces overran the capital soon after the war began in April 2023. One final part I wanted you to... Okay, yeah. They completely ransacked the Kushite Gold Room, which house hundreds of ornamental pieces. She said...

Necklaces and rings made entirely of gold, jewelry dating back to the time of the Kush civilization from the Kingdom of Napata and Mero were found inside royal burial chambers. The museum held the world's most important collection of artifacts from the Kingdom of Kush, an ancient Nubian culture whose Pharaoh once conquered Egypt. It also housed objects that testify to the rich range of influences including Islamic and Christian

that have shaped Sudan over its long history. Now, we read a book yesterday titled Precolonial Black Africa. Chekadzid Diop was able to do his research based on the fact that there were artifacts to look at to be able to chronicle. What would someone in his shoes be able to do if they wanted to do a similar type research today?

Adesoji Iginla (01:09:06.678)
in light of what has happened here. Over to you.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:09:16.401)
I'm glad that you did evoke Sheikhan Taddeo in his book because of course we know this is not the first time that Sudan's history has been looted and what we see happening in Sudan is also not actually even unique to Sudan. saw that, those of us who were paying attention during the Iraq War.

Adesoji Iginla (01:09:32.394)
unique to Sudan.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:09:39.375)
where they went in and they just decimated centuries of artifacts and information that, hey, nobody knows where it is, but it's in somebody's basement of private collection. will show up years from now. It's probably collateral for some yachts or print plane or maybe a.

Adesoji Iginla (01:09:42.434)
the museum.

Adesoji Iginla (01:09:49.186)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:10:00.545)
spaceship that is going to Mars or something. And so we know that in the 19th century and early 20th century that European colonial expeditions removed Sudanese and Nubian artifacts for Western museums under the guise of scientific archaeology. We know that under Anglo-Egyptian rule from 1899 to 1956,

Sudanese antiquities were catalogued and interpreted through colonial epistemologies. We know that because again, it's always about Trying paint Africa as this primitive place with no culture and no history

Adesoji Iginla (01:10:39.054)
Hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (01:10:44.878)
Correct.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:10:44.943)
and what they basically attempted to do was to sever Kushite and Nubian civilizations from African history. We know that these, having Sudan in this weakened state makes it very vulnerable to all of this illicit excavation and the trafficking. And so, again,

Anyone could have foreseen this that was paying attention So the article in particular as I was reading through it notes that the Kushite Gold Room That housed artifacts from Napata and Mereo were completely ransacked So this is probably not just someone who is like, you know some soldier who doesn't know what they're doing. Yes someone knows what they were doing and and and

Adesoji Iginla (01:11:24.699)
That's yeah. They were still to order.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:11:39.405)
is very actively taking these items out. But the kingdom of Kush directly challenges this whole Eurocentric idea that Africa is peripheral to world civilization. And so yes, if you gut it,

Adesoji Iginla (01:11:46.97)
Mm.

Adesoji Iginla (01:11:52.728)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:11:55.823)
and we don't have any proof or evidence of who we are, any fiscal evidence that Africa produced any advanced states or any metametology or architecture or whatever. It's easier to continue to carry on these stories.

that we then imbibe and believe, we are an inferior people and so we should always be grateful for whatever the white man can come in and share with us. So now looking at the RSF and we've covered Sudan and the RSF on numerous occasions on this show, who are they?

and what are they about? And I don't know if you want to fill us in again on that, Adesoggi, because RSF was never about, there is a distinction between the Arabs and the Black Africans. And they were never designed to protect Sudanese society and certainly not Black Sudanese, right? And so you,

Adesoji Iginla (01:12:48.024)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, correct.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:13:02.257)
You just have to wonder what is amiss here beyond the fact that these are valuables that people can make money from. It's also the erasure that is very concerning to me as well.

Adesoji Iginla (01:13:11.48)
Mm-hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:13:23.141)
Museums should be neutral spaces. They should be places that are protected, even in times of war. They are places that affirm continuity. But when you do that, we're talking about memory and what happens when a people have no memory. If you have no memory, then you have no history, right? You have no history, you have no sense of yourself, you almost have no future. And so...

Adesoji Iginla (01:13:28.893)
The war,

Adesoji Iginla (01:13:42.446)
It's true. Yeah.

Adesoji Iginla (01:13:47.803)
You're correct.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:13:50.755)
We should be very concerned about what's going on. Who are we going to get support from? Who's going to care? That's the question. Where are we going? Who's going to help fight this on the international level? Who is going to point out when they find these stolen artifacts and care about returning it? And is there even a Sudanese government in place that will say, yes, this is worth preserving?

depending on whether that government is headed by people who, by yes, a black African, or whether it is by someone who would like to help with those black people. So those who have no history have no present, have no future. So we should be very concerned about our erasure in this way through the erasure of our artifacts.

Adesoji Iginla (01:14:21.102)
by an African.

Adesoji Iginla (01:14:42.082)
And it's funny that the story would come to light in February because February seems to be the month where the British did carry out a lot of expeditions while they were running their colonial projects. Many people would remember the Binin Empire. That was ransacked and most of it now sits.

in part of British collections, British Museum for people to come and go catch, you know, but.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:15:15.441)
So what I would say to us, because I'm always looking for a case of what are the solutions here? I've had the opportunity now to go to Kemet twice. And the first time I went, I was just overwhelmed and just in awe and kind of in la la land. The second time I was a lot more deliberate and God willing, if I get to go back again, I would be even more present. But I think.

Adesoji Iginla (01:15:18.926)
Hmm.

Adesoji Iginla (01:15:33.666)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:15:43.521)
us being very intentional about cataloging our own history. Whether it's interviewing elders in your family or whether it's keeping your own memories and certainly you know like I have I have a doc actually I have a notebook from when my grandmother

Adesoji Iginla (01:15:45.774)
attention.

Adesoji Iginla (01:15:51.032)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:16:09.701)
was part of an organization where they lent money to each other because they could not get money from the colonial system. And they supported one another and I have, know, where people would write in for what they needed the money for and then the loans that would be given and then when they would have paid and so on and so forth. And I've kept that.

Adesoji Iginla (01:16:15.832)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:16:29.829)
because it's proof of what we were able to do for ourselves. And so all of us have a role to play in preserving our history and our artifacts because if we don't, then we stand to allow others to erase us.

Adesoji Iginla (01:16:34.804)
Okay.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:16:49.987)
And we are living history today, right? Our lives today will become the history of tomorrow. So accumulate what you can, catalog what you can. And if you're ever in these spaces where you can see these things, museums or whatever, take your own pictures, catalog, keep evidence of it, because we never know when we're going to need that to prove not to others, but to ourselves, the essence of who we are.

Adesoji Iginla (01:16:53.986)
History tomorrow, yes.

Adesoji Iginla (01:17:14.722)
Let's know, see ya.

Adesoji Iginla (01:17:18.606)
Yes, let's leave it on that positive note. With that, we've come to the end of this week's episode of African News Review. Just before we go, this Wednesday, we are going to marking the first anniversary of Women and Resistance. We're asking people to come in and have a seat with us. With regards to anyone of our

subjects that we've spoken about and what we can do to improve women and resistance. We're happy to hear from you. Again, send me.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:17:58.929)
My mother said don't call them subjects

Adesoji Iginla (01:18:02.702)
OK. The sisters who have led our revolution and helped push back against what we've experienced. So that's it, sister.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:18:17.623)
Realism. Yes. Yes.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:18:25.145)
I'm so grateful for this community. I'm grateful to you. I'm grateful for everybody. The chat has been blowing up today. I wish I knew your real names. I'm just looking at I hope to meet all of you at some point in person. But thank you for us being able to just have these conversations and to think about these issues. And hopefully we can get some of our younger people, you know, more involved in paying attention. One of the things that.

Adesoji Iginla (01:18:48.366)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:18:52.043)
really hit home for me yesterday as we were going through the book by Shekanta Jop is.

that the education we receive should be put to use for our liberation. And you know that man just followed his curiosity, but everything was geared not towards can I get another letter behind my name or can I get a new title or can I get more money, but really about solving our own problems and figuring out how to liberate us. And when I talk to the young people in my life, it's like, how will you use your life in

service to us as a collective. so thank you so much for this forum and just this opportunity to delve into our our our issues because it is sharpening me and helping me to make better choices with my time and my money.

Adesoji Iginla (01:19:48.553)
Thank you. Thank you. No, I mean, thank you for coming through. Now your co-host of three of my thoughts. So I mean, what else can I ask for? So I promise not to come up with other ideas. Maybe one more, but I promise.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:20:05.073)
And there will be no more. There will be no more. No.

Adesoji Iginla (01:20:14.636)
Yeah, that said, until Wednesday when we come again to Women and Resistance, it's been a pleasure being here with all of you. Again, we thank you all for coming through week in, week out. So another of our babies is marking its first year anniversary, which is Women and Resistance.

We see you all on Wednesday. Until then, it's good night and God bless.

Adesoji Iginla (01:20:52.302)
Thanks